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| Guest1. 09. 2007 21:25:23 |
Hi.
Does anyone on our secured paths use a self-belay kit (for clipping to steel cables)?
I'm wondering how useful it is in our Alps.
Is it worth buying and where would it be the cheapest?
I don't do wall climbing, but I do take somewhat more demanding paths.
Best regards
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| Guest1. 09. 2007 22:12:49 |
What kind of questions! 
If you're going on secured paths like via ferratas, then buy it! It's not really cheap anywhere, check Iglusport, Anapurna, K2... And don't forget the helmet! 
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| Guest2. 09. 2007 16:16:16 |
I use such a kit on all demanding paths secured with cables.
Regarding price: if you assemble it yourself or have an alpinist help you, it will cost less, but I don't know about such a kit on organized tours. I know, when I once bought a belay plate, a mountain guide told me she requires original kits from clients. Does anyone have experience with this, whether they reject a homemade kit. Best, Boštjan
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| Guest3. 09. 2007 07:49:03 |
When I started "looking around" for a self-belay kit, they taught me to buy the Y-shaped one, price from 85€ up. Cheaper ones are lower quality. Good luck!
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| Guest3. 09. 2007 09:11:57 |
If they recommended the Y one to you, why do they sell the others at all?
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| Guest3. 09. 2007 10:01:47 |
I personally use a helmet, full climbing harness and self-belay kit on all secured paths, because I want to return safely from the mountain.
I'd recommend you read some guide about mountaineering and secured paths (libraries have them too), then you won't wonder what and why something is needed, or join a mountaineering club.
Best
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| Guest3. 09. 2007 14:09:50 |
We return safely from the mountain, but from the mountain???
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| Guest6. 09. 2007 18:24:40 |
I always use a helmet, with the self-belay kit it's like this: In my humble opinion, you don't even need the Y system in our mountains, because it just hinders and terribly slows you down. It's really hard to find someone who uses the Y self-belay kit correctly. The reason is that our paths are equipped with cables meant for assistance in progressing, not for protection. On every meter where the cables are attached to the wall, no one will properly clip for long - it's extremely time-consuming. And the force in a fall on that meter isn't that great for the kit to fulfill its true purpose. In Italy,... it's a completely different system. Cables are attached to the wall at much greater distances and swing like a dog's..., you can't even hang on them and pull up. There the self-belay kit can save you from serious fall consequences (cushion the fall).
Personally at home I use a harness, good meter of rope and a nut - and even with that I have plenty to do!
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| Guest7. 09. 2007 13:03:27 |
Thanks for this info. In the shop they advise you like that so they sell the more expensive item. Good luck!
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| John7. 09. 2007 13:05:15 |
I'm specifically interested in which ascents you used the self-belay kit. Is it needed for the ascent to Skuta (Češka hut - Mlinarsko saddle - Dolgi hrbet - Skuta)? My humble opinion is no. Same for Kočna (Češka hut - Kočna). With full concentration and sufficient fitness, you can go without the self-belay kit. But really, no "contribution" to extra safety is too much.
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| Guest7. 09. 2007 18:33:14 |
I agree with the guest that we don't need Y kit here. Because the "drawback" of the V system is that both legs with carabiners must not be clipped to the cable at the same time, because then there's no shock absorption, two carabiners like in Y kit aren't needed here, because due to such taut cables falls are very short.
John, personally I'm a big safety freak, maybe sometimes too much, and I did both ascents with the kit. My belief is that it can come in handy if concentration drops (falling rocks...) and I still have some protection. Best, Boštjan
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| modri8. 09. 2007 20:37:04 |
I personally think you won't need the Y kit here, as it's completely useless, but I agree it's highly recommended to always have a climbing harness with prusik and carabiner and helmet where exposed sections are protected with cables. If needed, adjust it so that you have two carabiners if crossing is required. I think we often do too little for our own safety. I've been hiking in the mountains for over 20 years and only in the last few years use helmet, harness,... because I care about myself... maybe we realize it too late, it saddens me when I hear some literally boast about all they've traversed without protection... they were lucky, maybe next time not...
regards
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| Guest8. 09. 2007 21:20:38 |
Or maybe they're just bluffing....
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| Guest8. 09. 2007 22:17:26 |
You think you're tough if you don't use the SV kit? You're badly mistaken.
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| Kobra 19. 09. 2007 07:06:54 |
I'm among those who broke new ground by wearing a helmet and using protection when needed. Quite often we were the target of mockery ("look at the tough guys..."). Fortunately, things are turning for the better here too, at least among our mountaineers. Something else with foreigners, except Austrians.
Regards,
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| Guest9. 09. 2007 11:38:13 |
I think helmet is almost essential on secured paths, because they are steep and rocks often loosen, especially on popular paths where those ahead "sweep" and everything flies down. Regarding the sv. kit, I think it's not that necessary here because paths are really well secured. I think it's more a matter of personal preference. Whoever feels safer with it should have it. It's true though that Slovenians are a bit stingy in this regard. At the top of Prisojnik there were Italians next to us fully protected from head to toe (helmets, sv. kit, ice axes,...), unlike us who had nothing (over s. wall via Kopiščarjeva). I'm not saying it's okay, but... Somehow like these Russians: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwCyM84HCcA
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| Guest13. 09. 2007 21:22:00 |
I'm interested if someone can describe (picture how to tie the self-belay kit yourself. I have a carabiner and 4m rope.
Regards
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| modri19. 09. 2007 19:55:06 |
Hard to show in pictures, go to the library and borrow a mountaineering book - it has to be a bit older, because I think you won't find this knot in newer ones, as it's dangerous, namely if you tie the rope around your waist as self-belay knot yourself, it can happen that if you fall more than 1.5 m it can break your back, that's why climbing harness is used. Self-belay knot only if really no other option,...
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| zmaja26. 09. 2007 22:52:35 |
I also use SV kit, last time when I went to Triglav, there was a lady who mocked me saying such harnesses are for real mountaineers who have been to mountains many times, not for ordinary people like me, and that on the way to Triglav. Actually it's about my personal safety and I feel safer with it, that I can clip in and not fall into abyss.
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| Guest27. 09. 2007 09:55:20 |
Doesn't matter how many times you go to mountains, the kit gives security and can save you. S.Potocnik
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