PZS insurance and OEAV card (Austria)
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| ljubitelj gora20. 08. 2013 11:03:45 |
It started being written in this thread but it has become unmanageable:
http://www.hribi.net/trenutnerazmere.asp?slo=1&gorovjeid=10001&id=4569&stran=8
Austrian alpine association, where insurance covers rescue cases from foreign mountains and you can be worry-free
http://www.alpenverein.at/portal/
Completely misleading and membership fee is p*ssy smoke, abroad you still pay rescue costs and at huts they throw you in the trash with less comfort so-called eastern junk.
http://www.pzs.si/vsebina.php?pid=79
I also posted this PZS insurance in FB group, where a comment from A.Č. appeared. Since I won't copy the comment I'll just do PRT.SC.
P.s. If someone is bothered by the picture with text please contact administrator @Tadeja or Rok. With this thread I just want to point out the facts and that it's smart to get properly insured before going abroad, but not with us but with northern neighbors.
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| ljubitelj gora26. 08. 2013 12:03:01 |
Since accidents never rest in the mountains, it's smart to get well insured before going abroad. I opened this thread 6 days ago hoping for some new comment but as it looks eyes are closed and reconciled with what PZS Slovenia offers. To not copy comments that aren't mine I'll just summarize in my own words.
Between Slovenia and Italy (agreement for Western Julian Alps and part of Carnic Alps), costs are covered the same as at home, here B membership would suffice or better A+ due to sum up to 10,000 euros. 1 hour heli flight is good 2000 euros, which with B membership covering only up to 3500 euros might be too little, need to count personnel too.
But what when it says on PZS page:
That rescue costs are covered by the injured and after paying the bill you can claim debt from insurer, but IF they approve reimbursement at all, in the end you get excuses like our insurers.
As for Austria and our PZS Slovenia it's 1000x better to think twice than go up there to mountains, better go for coffee to Klagenfurt, if something happens on road it all goes from mandatory insurance.
Our favorite spot Cjajnik, Košutnikov turn (suspension bridge), Stolo climbing and easier peaks on Austrian side, if something happens then you're prepared to accept all costs, our PZS insurance doesn't apply there, everything is paid after rescue but since we're in EU now and most think what can they do to me you can quickly end up in court. Already fines from Austrian roads are sent to Slovenia and must be paid etc.
And also in summer our favorite destination Dolomites, people go there worry-free as PZS members but when it happens you can prepare a couple thousand euros.
I'm not expert, but mountain guides without insurance (they all are insured) wouldn't go even on beer to Dolomites to some hut.
How to avoid these worries, even rescue height is much higher up to 25000 euros, need to insure via northern neighbors OEAV, membership 55 euros and abroad you're worry-free but only for mountain rescue. For hospital care European card is needed and maybe some copay won't escape but that would be only about 500 euros, which with mountain rescue that can reach record 50,000 euros (talking climbing in some route and serious injury, this applies to ferratas too).
Wish everyone safe and smart. Yesterday I also browsed Austrian alpine association and it can be paid via credit card.
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| Zebdi26. 08. 2013 12:45:22 |
Insurance is what it is. Conditions are clearly written on PZS page, everyone decides themselves where to join. Claiming that insurance doesn't apply somewhere is a bit harsh.
I myself don't rely much on European card, because it doesn't cover transports - in that case copay can be much higher than above mentioned 500 euros. Better take Coris or Elvia and be worry-free.
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| ljubitelj gora26. 08. 2013 12:55:22 |
What kind of insurance should it be for 9 euros allocated from A+ membership.
Rescue costs in Slovenia are free for the injured.
I don't ski, so I didn't delve into that.
There are still holes in my comment, so it's good to write more about it too.
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| ljubitelj gora26. 08. 2013 12:56:38 |
http://www.coris.si/si/852/Asistenca.aspx
Reimbursement of costs I paid abroad?
If you paid for medical services abroad yourself, a reimbursement form is available. Print, fill it and send with original bills and reports to our address:
What kind of insurances are these 
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| Zebdi26. 08. 2013 12:59:07 |
It nicely says: if...
I think in practice bills up to about 150 EUR are paid, otherwise you just contact insurer immediately and you don't have to pay anything.
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| ljubitelj gora27. 08. 2013 12:45:59 |
Got a response from Coris, need to copay 33%.
I also wrote to RS for rescue and got this reply, how reliable I don’t know because everyone says something different:
If I understood correctly, in Italy rescue is free in certain regions they charge for possible loss, otherwise mostly free.
REPLY:
In Italy the rule is that rescue in case of accident in mountains, caving, gliding, mountaineering, climbing, etc., and possible medical care that follows, is free regardless of the rescue method and regardless of the nationality of the injured person (Italian or foreigner). All costs go to the state or regional health budget.
Some autonomous regions (Valle d'Aosta, Veneto and Trentino Alto Adige) charge the injured person rescue costs (fixed "ticket" or actual) only if no medical care in hospital follows the rescue.
Example: if you call the rescue service because you got lost, tired, etc., and they bring you to the car and you don’t need medical assistance, you must pay the rescue costs yourself; if they take you to hospital because you need medical care, everything is free, either rescue or medical care. This rule applies only in those three autonomous regions; in all other Italian regions rescue is always free regardless of causes and consequences of the intervention.
Insurance in three autonomous regions - option
If you are a CAI member with paid membership fee or have independently concluded suitable insurance or are a member of foreign alpine association with appropriate insurance those institutions will cover the costs, otherwise you must pay them yourself, because if no medical care follows the rescue, basic health insurance does not cover them.
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| ljubitelj gora28. 08. 2013 18:01:50 |
Another reply from RS for rescue:
Definitely insurance for abroad is a smart decision and I personally recommend it to avoid possible issues regarding coverage extent.
and another reply from PD:
in case rescue in foreign mountains is needed, the insured must settle the rescue bill. The amount will be reimbursed by the insurer afterwards if insurance coverage is confirmed.
More information can be obtained from the insurance broker GrECo JLT, d.o.o., Tine Breznik 01/300 61 56, mail: t.breznik@si.greco.eu
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| ljubitelj gora29. 08. 2013 09:43:55 |
@zebdi: I know conditions are written on the insurer but it’s good to write about it too, whom to ask:
Got reply from GrECo JLT insurer
Given that PZS has incomparably fewer members than in AT, insurance coverage is arranged accordingly and covers the maximum possible on the insurance market. It must be considered that only a small part of the membership fee is intended for insurance.
Past practice has shown that the insurer always reimbursed rescue costs if it occurred within the agreed coverage.
(my note if agreement reached)
We recommend concluding additional health assistance insurance for abroad (e.g. Coris etc.) in case of visiting foreign mountains. At the same time, check the scope of coverage with each provider, what within mountaineering activity is covered and what not. Usually hiking up to 3000 m (with supplement also higher), alpinism excluded.
For A+ members
Besides rescue costs arising from accident or life danger of insured, rescue costs insurance also covers:
•costs of rescuing uninjured climbing partner in connection with injured, if accident on mountain terrain from which uninjured climber could not safely continue alone;
•rescue costs in case of technical equipment damage if it does not allow safe continuation of tour or alpinistic ascent.
Rescue costs insurance for A and A+ members additionally covers:
•rescue costs in case of fainting, exhaustion and general distress on mountain that could endanger member’s life;
•rescue costs if member got stuck or lost and cannot safely continue tour.
Coverage provided for rescue costs up to altitude of 6000 meters, for alpinism and sport climbing up to 5000 meters.
Coverage for all categories includes only reimbursement of rescue costs. Coverage does not include 24-hour assistance during rescue. Insurance guarantee also does not apply to alpinistic expeditions that can be insured individually.
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| Dr.29. 08. 2013 10:50:43 |
I am a member of both PZS and Austrian OAV. PZS for belonging. OAV for trips abroad, as it includes insurance with assistance, insurance much larger than PZS with paid A membership. The point is assistance, which is not included in PZS insurance.
Membership in Austrian OAV: 55€ (postage included), wife/partner 40 €, children up to completed 27 years without own income have free membership. Provide their data and they receive card for current year.
Perhaps this too: at Coris you can conclude insurance for tours over 3000 m, which is not even expensive.
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| IgorZlodej29. 08. 2013 16:46:58 |
All honor to LG for bothering to dig up all this data that even insurance agents don't know. Still, the biggest investment of every mountain visitor is knowledge, experience, appropriate psychophysical readiness, appropriate equipment and useful knowledge of its usability, then of course appropriate insurance and hope that nothing really happens to you anywhere and never.
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| ljubitelj gora10. 09. 2013 12:12:18 |
Another part about rescuing uninjured persons from RS for rescue:
Hello.
Regarding reimbursement of rescue costs, this is determined by Article 118 of the Law on Protection against Natural and Other Disasters. Cases for which a claim for reimbursement of rescue costs due to negligence is submitted number about 5 per year.
Article 118
(covering costs)
(1) A natural or legal person who intentionally or due to gross negligence caused a hazard that resulted in costs of emergency action, or caused an accident, must cover:
– costs of protective and rescue interventions;
– costs of remediation and restoration to previous condition;
– costs of compensation to natural and legal persons.
(2) If there are multiple perpetrators of the hazard or accident from the previous paragraph and the share of each cannot be determined, they cover the costs jointly and severally.
(3) Regardless of the first paragraph of this article, a natural person who due to negligence, incompetence or inadequate equipment caused a hazard or accident or a situation that resulted in costs of emergency action must reimburse a proportional share of the intervention costs as determined by the government.
(4) The government determines activities in which participants must cover a proportional share of intervention costs regardless of the cause and responsibility for the accident and in which participants must be insured for the case of an accident. The proportional share of intervention costs is covered by the insurance company or the participants themselves if not insured.
(5) Funds obtained from reimbursement of emergency action costs or proportional shares of intervention costs are earmarked revenues of the rescue service or unit that carried out the emergency action or intervention and may only be used for its activities in accordance with this law.
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| jax15. 11. 2013 15:56:30 |
And who already knows what was decided at the meeting afterwards? Nothing has been published on the PZS website yet.
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| julius15. 11. 2013 16:13:00 |
Yes,
they accepted the proposal with arguments of power. This is a great incentive for young families. They will sleep on shared bunks and children will practically be educated with everything that usually happens there: farting, drunkenness, snoring, unrest late into the night and last but not least with sex education. Congratulations to the PZS president as well as UO PZS members and we must not forget the main initiator PD Ljubljana-Matica in the congratulations.
Next year I'll pay the membership fee despite all the patriotism of OAV.
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| Zebdi15. 11. 2013 19:07:04 |
They accepted it? Cool, this year's sticker is also the last on my membership card.
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| a520. 11. 2013 21:58:56 |
If you can't beat them...join them.
It's a waste of energy for the PZS to compete with the OeAV regarding insurance.
I would find it more logical to have an OeAV Slovenia Section for insurance and discounts abroad. In our huts only PZS should apply without reciprocity. And it should be possible to join directly in the hut.
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| julius22. 11. 2013 16:56:43 |
Mountain lover.
Good thing the Hribi.net forum exists, they don't delete you easily here. On the PZS forum your well-intentioned question on the topic "PZS insurance" was posted for only a couple of hours. As soon as they arrived at work, they deleted it.
Yes, yes, that's democracy and attitude towards membership.
Best regards.
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